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PostPosted: Sat Aug 22, 2009 9:44 am 
Here are some pictures of my in progress adaptation of the Klepper S-2 sailrig & traveler to my Folbot G-II.

Image

Image

Image

I am awiting an outrigger package & upgraded "Airfom" seats from Folbot.

I still have a few details to iron out on the rigging.


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 22, 2009 4:40 pm 
It seems to fit alright!


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 22, 2009 7:54 pm 
Romainpek wrote:
It seems to fit alright!


Well the G-II is thew same length & beam as the Klepper Aerius II.

It just required a few mods to mounting hardware, etc.


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 22, 2009 9:34 pm 
forum fanatic

Joined: Fri Mar 20, 2009 11:21 pm
Posts: 71
Those are great photos and the entire rig looks super!
Have you sailed it yet and if so what is the performance like?
Is it possible to use it with spray covers?
HP
FC Kahuna
FC Klondike


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 23, 2009 1:29 am 
Klepper leeboards appear to be larger (total area of both) than one Folbot leeboard. So, if you ordered a Folbot leeboard with the outrigger (it is NOT included for free unless you buy the whole sail rig from Folbot) - you might want to send it back to Folbot and keep your Klepper leeboards with that short piece of cross-thwart. I didn't like Folbot leeboard when I had it. Too small and has other problems.

Spraycover (somebody asked) will be too much inconvenience in handling 2 or 3 sails on 2 separate masts. I can have a sprayskirt on a single kayak with a single mast, only one control line and no "control board". My 2 cam cleats are mounted on the outrigger cross-thwart, there are no horn cleats or other fairleads. One cam cleat is for uphaul, and one - for downhaul tensioning (either line is adjusted only occasionally, and not needed in normal course of sailing). There is only one line to control and I don't use any cleat with this line. And even then, sometimes I have to undo the skirt to get up in order to reef the sail or strap the lowered sail to the deck.


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 23, 2009 11:59 am 
treecutter wrote:
Those are great photos and the entire rig looks super!
Have you sailed it yet and if so what is the performance like?
Is it possible to use it with spray covers?
HP
FC Kahuna
FC Klondike


I'm still woring on the conversion. Still ironig out some rigging attachment points, etc.

The Outriggers & upgaded seats from Folbot will be here on the 25th & we will be leaving for 5 days of camping, sailing & paddling in the Adirondackls on the 27th.

I will have a full report & pix the week after next.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 25, 2009 12:35 am 
Don't know what exactly are the latest developments of the Folbot in spraydeck area - I've heard they have some new spaydeck now. AFAIK, the problems with schooner rig and spraycover on this type of boat are twofold:

1) You need a freedom of movement around the cockpit. With 2 masts and 2 (or 3) sails pretty soon something happens that need your close attention. Literally "close" - when you have to come up to the mast and change or fix something. With the spraydeck on, the freedom of movement is restricted.

2) Spraydeck on GII or AEII is not like sprayskirt on FC single, the latter I can remove it in a second (and it remains on my hips, being exactly a skirt). On those large open-cockpit double kayaks it is a spraydeck, covering the entire cockpit, with a funnel (or two) for paddler's torso. Once attached with numerous star-knobs (can be Velcro in case of Klepper), and with masts and J-bolts placed through the spraydeck, there is no easy way to remove it.

Those who sail GII or AEII with 2 masts, normally (if not always) have no spraydeck attached, trying to boost the buoyancy (flotation) instead, to minimize whatever water would get in the cockpit in heavy winds. I'm not saying that sprayskirt is not possible in combination with 2 masts on these boats - I just see that people don't or can't use it.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 25, 2009 8:27 am 
Alm wrote:
Don't know what exactly are the latest developments of the Folbot in spraydeck area - I've heard they have some new spaydeck now. AFAIK, the problems with schooner rig and spraycover on this type of boat are twofold:

1) You need a freedom of movement around the cockpit. With 2 masts and 2 (or 3) sails pretty soon something happens that need your close attention. Literally "close" - when you have to come up to the mast and change or fix something. With the spraydeck on, the freedom of movement is restricted.

2) Spraydeck on GII or AEII is not like sprayskirt on FC single, the latter I can remove it in a second (and it remains on my hips, being exactly a skirt). On those large open-cockpit double kayaks it is a spraydeck, covering the entire cockpit, with a funnel (or two) for paddler's torso. Once attached with numerous star-knobs (can be Velcro in case of Klepper), and with masts and J-bolts placed through the spraydeck, there is no easy way to remove it.

Those who sail GII or AEII with 2 masts, normally (if not always) have no spraydeck attached, trying to boost the buoyancy (flotation) instead, to minimize whatever water would get in the cockpit in heavy winds. I'm not saying that sprayskirt is not possible in combination with 2 masts on these boats - I just see that people don't or can't use it.


1: This is not a "schooner rig" it is a "sloop rig".

2: Where do you see 2 masts? There is a mast & a gaff boom @ the top of the main sail.

3: The spraydeck on the G-II is also velcro attached. There are no "J" bolt penetrations & if needed I'm sure that the mast penetration could be made W/some velcro closures to ease removal.

All this is a moot point as I do not plan to use the spraydeck, nor do I plan to sail in heavy winds except for possibly being caught out in them in which case I would head to shore immediately.

This craft will be sailed on inland lakes primarily in the Adirondacks. W/2 people aboard.

Even W/the spraydeck on, W/a 2 man crew, there would not be any reason to move about the cockpit to handle this rig.

The "2 masted" configuration you cite will allow the mainsail to be dropped merely by letting out the mainsail halyard. The Gaff boom (which is what I assume you are refering to as the 2nd mast) will then drop to the boom thus reducing the main sail area to 0.

I am looking into making a jib furler so that the jib can be taken in @ a moments nitice.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 25, 2009 12:41 pm 
Ops... It's a 1-mast configuration really. Another Klepper rig (S4, if I recall correctly) has a gaff, and it's still all on one mast. Some people installed a mizzen mast, though (in addition to standard Klepper rig).

With or without J-bolts through the spraycover, you can't remove it easily on water because it can't be removed easily ;-) . Also, control board is holding it down. If you decide to install an outrigger crossbar separately from the leeboards crossbar, you'll have one more obstacle to remove. But, since you're not going to use a spraycover, the point is moot indeed. With a crew of two you'll have less need in moving around the cockpit, that's true. With only one person aboard you'll have to walk around the cockpit at some point. A second person, while making sailing TAD easier (mostly to attend to the sails occasionally, - there is no lines in this rig to control for another person) and TAD slower, will also restrict your paddling options. And paddling is already restricted with an outrigger, boom, and all those control and other lines around. It is very desirable to be able to paddle at a reasonable speed if wind conditions don't let you sail, unless you're sailing close to shore or to your put-in point. Hopefully you'll have enough wind on most days to enjoy sail.

What happens when you make it a better sailboat - with more sails, gadgets like jib furler, some outrigger (and then you can carry even more sails) - it becomes less paddle-able. And less foldable. More stuff to transport, assemble and dissemble.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 15, 2009 11:44 pm 
I would love to see more pictures! Where did you pick up the Klepper sail rig? How much was it? I just got a greenland 2 and am interested in getting a sail kit. Thanks for sharing!


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 20, 2009 10:17 am 
Indeed. Great rig. Looks good on the GII. Will do the same to mine.
cheers,

PK


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 25, 2010 7:26 pm 
Thanks to Power Wagon's help I was able to do about the same thing. Please check out my album here for pictures:

http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=2 ... b2f05bdb6b


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 26, 2010 10:53 pm 
Brotherhood of the Golden Paddle

Joined: Sun Aug 16, 2009 10:05 pm
Posts: 1427
Location: South Salem, NY
Couldn't get your link to work Nicholai.

PowerWagon - that looks really great!

I'm in upper Westchester Co. - Give me a holler if you're ever sailing in the neighborhood, I'll come and join you.

Dennis

_________________
Klepper Aerius II
Klepper T9
Long Haul MK1 Expedition 'light'
Klepper S4 sail rig
Kayaksailor 1.6 +genoa
BSD 36HP


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 27, 2010 10:03 am 
Here try this link???


http://s382.photobucket.com/albums/oo26 ... ief/Kayak/


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