Folding Kayaks Forum

The user forum for FoldingKayaks.org
It is currently Tue Dec 11, 2018 3:14 pm

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 40 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3
Author Message
PostPosted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 9:15 am 
Brotherhood of the Golden Paddle

Joined: Sun Aug 16, 2009 10:05 pm
Posts: 1398
Location: South Salem, NY
Quote:
have your son do the hiking

working on this Chris. Set it all up and dead calm days ensued. Bummer.

But more experience was garnered by the shade tree kayaker...

The Klepper S2 rig fits the Balogh mast pretty nicely using only three sections. It'll work with all four sections but the gaff rig doesn't want to hang right. The gaff 'collar' is a tight fit, but once in place works fine.
Image

Rigging to sail with my son I initially set up the S2 rig and the BSD outriggers because the BSD mast doesn't fit in the Klepper mast partner. The Long Haul BSD outrigger/control board wasn't set up real well for the S2 sail, no jib cleats, and I couldn't use the jib loop system, so I mounted my other control board behind the BSD board... too many boards. Was considering dropping the second control board for the Klepper leeboard crossbar (to manage the jib sheets) when I stepped back and looked at all those lines. It was too much for my uninitiated son to be thrown into. I went to the hardware store, bought a 10 inch curved file and opened up the Klepper mast hole to fit the BSD mast. Took about twenty minutes of filing and fitting, much simpler than I thought it would be.

Now the BSD fits in the Klepper AEII nicely. I still need to add a couple hooks to the coaming for the main sheet 'Y harness,' but we are basically ready to go. Now all we need is time and wind. Bottom line is that this was a very easy modification.

Although I've only played the scenario out in the yard... my neighbors think I'm nuts... rigging and striking the 'entire' BSD rig on the AEII should be very doable out on the water.

d

_________________
Klepper Aerius II
Klepper T9
Long Haul MK1 Expedition 'light'
Klepper S4 sail rig
Kayaksailor 1.6 +genoa
BSD 36HP


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 10:16 am 
Brotherhood of the Golden Paddle

Joined: Mon Apr 18, 2005 3:40 pm
Posts: 1113
Location: isles of scilly UK
Dennis, it looks like you have just about "cracked it". Now a boat for each set of sails and you can have the "Dennis Sailing event" where various sails are sailed against each other up and down the lake. Has anyone yet come around to tell you "You need water" when "sailing around your garden", it happened on my drive on numerous occasions. Who needs water it,s fun without getting wet. But you have built up a great deal of knowledge and interest in all these sails and all members of the forum should be gratefull.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 4:04 pm 
Brotherhood of the Golden Paddle

Joined: Sun Aug 16, 2009 10:05 pm
Posts: 1398
Location: South Salem, NY
Thanks John. What I really need is a neighbor like you so we can go out and play together!

Some of my neighbors comment, "Shouldn't you be out on the lake?" Most of them look away, shake their heads, and say to my wife, "oh you poor dear..."

So here's a math problem. Someone back me up on this...

In order to improve the number accuracy to the visual comparisons at the beginning of this thread I measured the small Klepper S1 mainsail (as it appears to be a simple right triangle) to help determine the area of the Klepper S2 jib. All sizes beyond this are based on the 'round' numbers we get from the manufacturers.

The S1 sail measures 48" foot X 68.5" luff. Doing the math I come up with 11.4 sq. ft. or 1 sq. meter. - smaller than the Kayaksailor 1.6 w/o jib.

This would mean that the Klepper jib is about 17.6 sq. ft. or 1.63 sq. m. - the same size as the Kayaksailor.

This would make the S2 Main sail approximately 37.4 sq. ft. or 3.47 sq. m, slightly larger than the BSD 36HP. I didn't expect that.

If this info looks correct I'll add it to the first post in this thread. Let me know.

d

_________________
Klepper Aerius II
Klepper T9
Long Haul MK1 Expedition 'light'
Klepper S4 sail rig
Kayaksailor 1.6 +genoa
BSD 36HP


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Sep 19, 2015 4:19 am 
Brotherhood of the Golden Paddle

Joined: Mon Apr 18, 2005 3:40 pm
Posts: 1113
Location: isles of scilly UK
Dennis, just had a quick look at Klepper add,s they say the S1 main and jib are approximatly 2.5m sq. The S4 which is probably the same as the S2, main and jib are aproximatly 5m sq. I will have to look further to see if they give areas of each sail. In Complete Folding Kayaker by Ralp Diaz he says the Klepper S4 main is 32 sq ft and the jib is 16 sq ft.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Sep 19, 2015 6:22 am 
Brotherhood of the Golden Paddle
User avatar

Joined: Thu Apr 14, 2005 4:47 pm
Posts: 1716
Location: Arlington, VA (i.e. Wash DC)
DLee wrote:
Most of them look away, shake their heads, and say to my wife, "oh you poor dear..."

To which your wife should retort "it's cheaper than a mistress! "

I always understood that the S4 was larger than the S2 (?).

_________________
Chris T.
~'91 Klepper A2 w/ BSD schooner rig.
'64 Klepper Passat/Tradewind and T12 restoration projects.
Non-folding: Early '90s Old Town Canoe.
Previously owned '04 Pakboat Puffin II and '05 Swift (prototype), as well as an '84 Hobie 16.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Sep 19, 2015 10:36 am 
Brotherhood of the Golden Paddle

Joined: Mon Apr 18, 2005 3:40 pm
Posts: 1113
Location: isles of scilly UK
The S4 might be larger than the S2.. I have the S2 and the S3 and if i remember correctly by laying the sails on top of each other they were just about the same size.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Sep 22, 2015 11:56 pm 
Brotherhood of the Golden Paddle

Joined: Sun Aug 16, 2009 10:05 pm
Posts: 1398
Location: South Salem, NY
Refresh my memory gentlemen. The S4 came first correct? and the S2 is the current model? The S1 is the smaller main sail. What is the S3? I don't believe I've heard of that one John.

d

_________________
Klepper Aerius II
Klepper T9
Long Haul MK1 Expedition 'light'
Klepper S4 sail rig
Kayaksailor 1.6 +genoa
BSD 36HP


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2015 7:19 am 
lord high faltbotmeister

Joined: Thu Sep 06, 2007 8:05 am
Posts: 824
Location: atlanta, georgia
Speaking strictly from experience, the S1 and S2 are both upwind sail rigs; the S1 is about half the sail area of the S2 and it is primarily used on the Klepper singles; the S2 is the same as the S4, Klepper just renamed it sometime over the last 20 years or so; I have never heard of S3 but I am always willing to learn more.

Best,
g

_________________
"There is nothing--absolutely nothing--half so much worth doing as simply messing around in boats"

1990 A1 Expedition
2010 carbon Klepper Quattro
BSD sail rig, 24' mizzen + 36' main
36' jib
Torqeedo outboard
1938 Sachs-Fichtel seitenbordmotor


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2015 5:28 pm 
Brotherhood of the Golden Paddle

Joined: Mon Apr 18, 2005 3:40 pm
Posts: 1113
Location: isles of scilly UK
The S4 was first the the S2/S3 next and i think they are all the same sail as far as sail area. It is possible that klepper used the S3 designation in Europe. The S1 main has a much smaller area than the S2 main, the jibs they used are the same. I hope the Klepper adds can be seen , the program wouldn,t let me have larger sizes so i hope these can are clear enough. From the 2011 catalog.


You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Sep 24, 2015 1:25 pm 
Brotherhood of the Golden Paddle

Joined: Sun Aug 16, 2009 10:05 pm
Posts: 1398
Location: South Salem, NY
Thanks for that John. Weird that they mention the S3 in the title but not the text.

So using this as a guide or confirmation... I'm going to assume that my measurements and calculations are either correct or 'close enough.' I'll update the data in the first posting.

d

PS - still trying to get out with the AEII and BSD. We've had beautiful days here in NY of clear skies and little wind. Great for everything but sailing and the plants. Took out the MK1 and KS the other day in light breezes. Very fun and quite relaxing. No sponsons or outriggers necessary.

_________________
Klepper Aerius II
Klepper T9
Long Haul MK1 Expedition 'light'
Klepper S4 sail rig
Kayaksailor 1.6 +genoa
BSD 36HP


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 40 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group