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PostPosted: Wed Oct 28, 2009 6:11 am 
Veeeeeeery nice Tom. The low weight and high capacity makes this kayak very attractive.

Are you happy with the nylon sponson sheathes?

I see you do not use a D ring or similar interface between deck hardware and hull. It would seem that the pull of the lines would deform the fabric interface over time. Or no... because of the very light weight of the boat? the durability of the fabric?

Nice looking seat pads.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 28, 2009 10:03 am 
Quote:
Are you happy with the nylon sponson sheathes?

I see you do not use a D ring or similar interface between deck hardware and hull. It would seem that the pull of the lines would
deform the fabric interface over time. Or no... because of the very light weight of the boat? the durability of the fabric?
Nice looking seat pads.


The nylon sleeves work great. Their low bulk and flexibility allows the skin to be folded as small as the Sonnet 16 with PVC sleeves.
Plus, weight was saved in the process.

I normally use D rings, but I didn't have enough for the job so I reinforced the carry strap PVC tie downs with a doubler at the top for
stiffness and strength. Seems to hold it's shape just fine on this lightweight kayak. The deck rigging will be more than adequate for my
minimal requirements. D rings are preferable however. I made 4 optional 1/4" alum rod deck stiffeners that fit over the top sponson
( under the deck) , and under the front of coaming and under the tie-downs when needed for heavier deck gear. Normall, I won't use them.
I've never had a glued tie down pull free.

No pads on the seats, just a 10oz PVC cover. I sometimes use a 1/2" closed cell pad or thermarest self inflating cushion over the seats or at
my back.

You might consider a 6 sponson single version of this boat. A 24 inch beam would keep you high and dry and carry lots of gear. The Sonnet
16 with 4 sponsons is a low and sometimes wet ride much like a Greenland SOF. I like it, but not all paddlers do.

Thanks for your interest in this project..... I'm still waiting for pics of your Sea Bee ?

Tom

Glue template
Image

Carry strap tiedowns with doublers
Image

Ready for action
Image


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 28, 2009 12:55 pm 
Thanks for all the info and for sharing your work Tom, and your suggestion for making a 6-tube single. If you have any more thoughts on this please post them here.

Perhaps a longer open cockpit with both single and double removable decks for use in more or less sheltered waters? High, dry, and stable would lend itself to that.

On the other hand, I might be wanting a single Sonnet for rough water and landings on surfy beaches and boat ramps.

Seabee photos will eventually come - by then there might be two - but at the moment I am moving, preparing to travel, and have lots of other work as well. Good news is that when I return from traveling I will have six 16' sponsons and some PVC fabric to play with.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 29, 2009 4:50 am 
Niice project, very impressive, and that is the coolest kayak transporter I've seen! 8)

Reminds me of my old car and my old kayak (Smart ForTwo + Pakboat Swift), similar concept but compact/budget style:

Image

Who needs a big trunk with a folder?

:lol:


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 29, 2009 9:24 am 
Quote:
Who needs a big trunk with a folder?


Or any trunk for that matter :wink: ..... Tom

http://yostwerks.com/DillonFold1.html - Off to the lake ( several pages)

Sonnet 16 plus all paddling gear in one bag.
Image


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 04, 2009 11:59 pm 
I paddled the Sonnet Combi as a single today while sitting in the aft coaming. It tracked and turned well, and paddling effort was fairly easy.
It took about 20 minutes to assemble, but I was not trying to hurry as I stopped a few times to take some pics.... speaking of which :roll: ....Tom

It's 37 miles of twisties from my house to the lake... and a 3,000ft descent through a life zone or three.
Image

At the lake...The skin was carried loosely packed in the front trunk, and the frame and paddling gear in the back.
Image

The 6 sponsons are first 3/4 inflated giving shape to the hull before assembly. No frame members are yet inserted.
Image

Paddling in 41 degree water. The frame is plenty rigid considering it's minimal structure. Even paddling this far aft, the forward keel / bow
are still under water. The 2-piece GP is 95" long.
Image

A different day, a different lake. At 4'11" Rita finds this double to her liking due to it's narrrow width / height.... and when she's happy, I'm happy :D
Image

Ready for assembly... I've just started on a 14' X 22" X 325lbs displ. single using 6ea X 13.5' Folbot sponsons.
Image


Last edited by Yostwerks on Tue Jan 26, 2010 11:02 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 26, 2009 6:15 pm 
Tom, you mention in your last post that you are starting on a 14' single. Any progress to report? I do hope so. A materials list to begin sourcing here in the UK would be great to be working on whilst the design is worked up.

Brian


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 29, 2009 12:17 pm 
Quote:
Tom, you mention in your last post that you are starting on a 14' single. Any progress to report? I do hope so.
A materials list to begin sourcing here in the UK would be great to be working on whilst the design is worked up.


Hi Brian,

I've finished the skinning frame, and have all the materials needed, but have not yet started skinning the boat. I hope to
get going on it in the next week or so. Then it will be no time till it's completed. I've been sidetracked with another project.

Materials list.... As long as you are aware that all is subject to minor changes, see below. Also, the list is likely not complete,
but the best I can do so early in the morning. I reckon it's enough to get you started. Plans / instructions will be available
after completion and testing. It's best to buy more tubing than specified.

Keel.. Aluminum tubing

1. 1ea X 1" X 9' center piece divided into 3ea X 3' sections. A 12' center keel is also possible.
The 15.5' double did fine with just a 10' X 1" center keel section.

2. Inserts for keel center piece are 4ea X 7/8" X 6"

3. Stems are 2ea X 3/4" X 3.5' before bending and trimming

Chines.. Aluminum tubing

1. 2ea X 3/4" X 15' ( divided into 3ft sections ) before trimming length to approx 14' each. I plan to go with
2 chines ( side stringers) initially, and add 2 more if needed. (See Note 1 below)

2. Inserts for chines are 8ea X 5/8" X 6" or double that if using 4 chines.

Cross Braces.. Aluminum Tubing

1. 2ea X 3/4" X 3ft before trimming ( 4ea for 4 chines)

2. hinges... made from 1/16" X 3ft aluminum plate. The exact process will be in the instructions.


Coaming...aluminum tubing

1. 2ea X 1/2" X 6ft before bending / trimming

2. Inserts... 2ea X 3/8"X 6"

Skin

1. 6 linear yards (18oz hull) and 6 linear yards ( 10oz deck) A linear yard is usually 61" X 36"US

Sponson Sleeves

1. 6 linear yards of 4oz ripstop or coated nylon

2. 10oz PVC from left over deck skin to serve as glueable backing for the sleeves

Rivets

1. 1/8" medium length

Note 1.... On this 3 sponson per side design, the chine is inserted between the bottom and middle sponson.

A second set of chines may be added between the middle and top sponson as on the Sonnet Combi double. I don't feel
the additional chine will be necessary on a single based on my experience with the Sonnet 14 and 16, but it may be
useful in certain situations. I'll know more when testing the boat. The top sponson's alone will add rigidity and most
of all greater depth ( 10 inches overall ) vs the 4 sponson Sonnets.

The fewer parts the better for assembly, transport, weight, and cost..... Keep it simple !

I'll add to and / or correct the materials list as it comes to me :roll:

Cheers, Tom


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 29, 2009 4:06 pm 
Thanks Tom, much apreciated, and, just to check, 6 Folbot sponsons Kodiak 13'6"

http://www.folbot.com/mm5/merchant.mvc? ... Code=PARTS

My local tube stockist, Hampshire UK, stocks the tubes in "inch" diameters which is great, lengths are all 4 metre, say 13', so that's ok too. Each of the OD sizes is stocked in 4 different wall thicknesses.

20 SWG that is 0.9mm or 0.036"
18 SWG 1.2mm or 0.048"
16 SWG 1.6mm or 0.064"
10 SWG 3.25mm or 0.128"

On your site the tubes walls are spec 0.058"

For this hybrid would you advice 18 SWG or 16 SWG as best option -checking for insert fit as well.

Thanks

Brian


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 29, 2009 6:28 pm 
Brian,
Yes... 6ea X 13'6" / Kodiak. All Folbot sponsons were marked down just before Xmas by 20%. Hopefully
they will do it again for new year's. A spare would be a good thing to have also.

I also use .049 wall, so I'd recommend 18 SWG 1.2mm or 0.048" of those you've listed . The 16 SWG 1.6mm or 0.064"
is just a bit too thick a wall allowing very little clearance especially if the inserts get scratched up
from daily use.... and they will (See attached pic)

http://www.yostwerks.com/Gap.html - .048 / .055 and metric

Looks like you have a nice imperial tubing selection. What's the cost per meter ?

Be sure to read the Folding Kayak Builders Manual as there's info there that will pertain to your inflatable / folder.

Happy New Year ..... Tom


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 30, 2009 12:46 pm 
I have sent off a request for quotation for 18 SWG tubing. Tubing is only supplied in 4m lengths so asked for a quote for one length of each size except for 3/4" which I requested 4 lengths. Probably not back at work till next week.

I have located a supplier who makes lorry side curtains and will supply PVC material by the metre, at £6.36 a metre. Weight is 560 gsm which works out at 16.5 oz / sq yrd. They only do one weight so will probably use for deck and hull?

http://www.protectivetextile.co.uk/inde ... ucts_id=27

Haywoods appear to supply both weights, about £9.45 / m

610 gsm - 18 oz
and 330 10 oz

http://www.haywoodproducts.com/textiles--fabrics

Happy 2010 to you Tom too!

Brian


Last edited by keyhavenpotterer on Wed Dec 30, 2009 4:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 30, 2009 3:00 pm 
We even seem to have a UK supplier of HH-66

http://hh-66.co.uk/index.php/order-online

what size tin would be enough for a first boat?

Thanks

Brian


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 30, 2009 4:34 pm 
Quote:
what size tin would be enough for a first boat?


2 qts (64oz) to be safe.

Tom


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 04, 2010 8:52 am 
Terrible quote for the alloy tubing. Each 4m length was between £47.30 and £21.58 so the total for tubing came to £414.00!!! Would be cheaper to buy carbon tubes from the far east! Will have to look else where.

Brian


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 04, 2010 10:49 am 
Quote:
Terrible quote for the alloy tubing. Each 4m length was between £47.30 and £21.58
so the total for tubing came to £414.00!!! Would be cheaper to buy carbon tubes from the far east!
Will have to look else where.


Hi Brian,

That's not terrible... That's criminal ! There must be less expenses sources available to you.
I pay £10.5 for 4m of 3/4" tubing from Texas Towers ( $1.30ft). They're a Ham Radio supplier.

http://www.texastowers.com/aluminum_.htm - Texas Towers Aluminum

I'll email a guy in Dundee Scotland who has built several folders to obtain his source / price and get back to you.

Over and out :roll:

Tom


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