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 Post subject: Hypalon
PostPosted: Fri Jun 01, 2018 10:46 am 
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Joined: Thu Mar 03, 2016 11:19 am
Posts: 76
Really more of just griping. So I picked up another Kodiak. Hoping for use or for parts. It has maybe a 4-7 mm hole through the Hypalon, and maybe 10x5 cm of heavy abrasion on the outside. Otherwise the hull is sound. However the hull again seems to be a different run of Hypalon than I have seen in other Kodiaks. It is nothing like my early Kodiak. This Hypalon seems to be lighter and it is doubtful I have enough Hypalon patch to cover this.

I also noted this later run of Kodiak used the same #5 stern frame as the #1 bow frame.

I really wish Folbot would have issued a materials sheet so we could at least track down the materials used in the construction of our kayaks. Things like make/model of hypalon, the deck material, screws and longerons, the thread. I also need to figure out how to deal with a pulled out combing cord. I'm trying to avoid cutting the seam and sewing it back in myself.

Last time I used some commercially available hypalon I was not pleased with how it compared to what was use on the Citibot. Anyone use the Pennel Orca material that NRS carries? Right now debating using AqualSeal & Cotol, and Tenacious Tape on the interior and my remnants of Folbot repair hypalon patch on the exterior (if big enough).

Hoosier Paddler
GIIx2, Kodiakx2, Edisto, Citibot


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 Post subject: Re: Hypalon
PostPosted: Sun Jun 03, 2018 8:08 pm 
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Joined: Thu Mar 24, 2016 6:40 pm
Posts: 34
HoosierPaddler wrote:
I also need to figure out how to deal with a pulled out combing cord. I'm trying to avoid cutting the seam and sewing it back in myself.

The tapered fiberglass shaft from a bike safety flag and a small zip-tie worked for me. Earl


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 Post subject: Re: Hypalon
PostPosted: Sun Jun 03, 2018 8:46 pm 
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Joined: Thu Mar 03, 2016 11:19 am
Posts: 76
I tried several options. I ended up carefully cutting the thread. When those deck pieces were initially sewn, the cord was fed under the foot of the sewing machine, creating a ridiculously tight welt. I'm going to hand sew several areas along the now released seam, just to keep the cord in place. I could use my sewing machine but I don't really have a sewing machine table with a large enough flat surface to maneuver around the hull. Better to be safe than sorry if I make a mistake.

Now to deal with the hole in the hull :(

HoosierPaddler
GIIx2. Kodiak x2, Edisto, Citibot


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 Post subject: Re: Hypalon
PostPosted: Fri Jun 08, 2018 10:11 pm 
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Joined: Thu Mar 03, 2016 11:19 am
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Update. So it is always interesting to go over Folbots of different years. This particular Kodiak must be a more recent vintage. It uses Hypalon with the more matte, nylon fabric finish to it. It also has a hull number of some sort sewed into aft, starboard side. Anyone remember how to decipher that number?

Anyhow this rescued Kodiak was not transported properly. My guess is that it was transported in the cheap "J" style of kayak carriers, and it was carried on its side. There are numerous other deep abrasions into the tire cord center of the Hypalon. Thankfully there was a tire cord center. I previously had a Cooper which had an even lighter version of Hypalon which seemed to be lacking the tire cord. That Cooper had a mouse eaten quarter to half dollar size hole in it. The hole in this Kodiak was about 5-7 mm. I cleaned any hole or abraded area with isopropyl alcohol and then 100% acetone. I filled the hole from interior and the surrounding area with the Cotol and Aquaseal mixture. Kept mixing that and let it sit for 5 minutes or so, then applied a circular Gear-Aid Tenacious Tape patch. The very deep abrasions, numerous spots well into the cord layer, were in two sets, each around 5-6 inches long and 8 or so inches apart. The deep abrasions were filled with Gear-Aid (formerly McNett) Neoprene Contact Cement aka AquaSeal +NEO. This was allowed to cure for 24 hours. I then applied the Cotol and AquaSeal over those large areas, and applied the remnants of Folbot adhesive hypalon patches from the Wilderness Repair Kit. This was allowed to cure for another 24 hours, and then I applied the AquaSeal +NEO around the edges of the two large Hypalon pathes. I also got a bright headlight and examined every inch of the rest of the hull. I found some other small abraded areas. I filled those with a Cotol+Aquaseal mixture, let it sit then applied more of the round Gear-Aid Tenacious Tape patches. I also found two other areas with abrasions not into the cord. I applied just the Tenacious Tape patch.

Original Folbot patches being such a rare commodity I need to look at other materials I can source locally. I might also look at getting some Pennel Orca CSM (i.e. Hypalon is the DuPont brand name) from a whitewater oriented company.

Test paddle tomorrow AM. If I don't become a u-boat commander I'll post some pictures of the completed repairs.

HoosierPaddler
GIIx2, Kodiak x2, Edisto, Citibot


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 Post subject: Re: Hypalon
PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2018 3:49 pm 
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Joined: Thu Apr 14, 2005 12:34 pm
Posts: 1727
Location: Southeast Michigan
Is the hull made from a light, textured, material? If so, it's not Hypalon, but another material Folbot was experimenting with. They recalled and replaced all the hulls made with it.

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Michael Edelman
FoldingKayaks.org Webmaster


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 Post subject: Re: Hypalon
PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2018 4:00 pm 
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Joined: Thu Mar 03, 2016 11:19 am
Posts: 76
Yeah I don't believe it is the EPDE, that was supposed to be even lighter. Wasn't that only in white? Didn't they try to use Kickstarter to get black material?

I think this Kodiak isn't that new as it still has the poly frame pieces not aluminum tube, but unique in that they stopped using a different Frame 1. This example has same frame for 1 and 5, but one of them is marked to be used a frame 1. I have a really old Kodiak to compare frames and Hypalon too. Love the old Hypalon.

I've seen a similar Hypalon on the Coopers, but I know at least one of those didn't have tire cord in the middle (the mouse hole revealed that).


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 Post subject: Re: Hypalon
PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2018 5:02 pm 
recent arrival

Joined: Sun May 15, 2016 8:38 pm
Posts: 2
The early Coopers had TPU hulls and I think Folbot offered to replace these with hypalon hulls if the owners chose to do so. Evaloy was the last material used and the first boats produced with this stuff was white. Later on they did a Kickstarter campaign to offer a black Evaloy hull.

I have a 1996 G2 and a 2006 Cooper; both with hypalon. But there is a big difference between the two. The G2 fabric is heavier and has a shiny surface. The Cooper has the matte finish.

I believe the last two digits of the hull number is the year the boat was produced. At least this is what I remember from the old Folbot forum. The last two digits on my Cooper is 06. I can't find a hull number on the G2.


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